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[Guides] PD Stacks and Attack Rate Cap

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Posted on 6/25/14 7:01:22 PM | Show thread starter's posts only

Edited by ForceClosed at 6-25-2014 08:12 PM

I've just watched a video of Phal killing boss 3 with his maxed out PD. He reaches the speed cap by 30 seconds and from there I counted TG procs up to 60 and PD procs up to 60. It took 80 seconds for Tg to reach 60 and 79 seconds for PD (we can assume the 1 second difference is due to proc timing i.e. Pd started proc'ing before TG).

If it takes 7 attacks to proc then we can take 60 procs x 7 = 420 attacks in 80 seconds. 80 / 420 = .19047 or approximately a 190 millisecond attack rate. We know attack rates are rounded up to the nearest X00 so 190 seems odd. I doubt there is a 90 MS delay on a 100 MS attack rate.

Cupid was in his team during the boss fight so I know a few procs occurred prematurely. During 80 seconds, Cupid can proc about 12 times. With 12 procs saving 3 attacks per proc (may be slightly more or less on average due to 100 energy cap) it will save 36 attacks. 420 - 36 = 384 attacks in 80 seconds. 80 / 384 is around 208 MS attack rate. So it seems likely that the real attack rate is capped at 200 instead of the believed 100 MS.

Now that we know the attack rate is 200 MS and procs occur rougly every 1.4 seconds, we also must realize PD stacks never reach 8-12 like Gyus's calculator shows. I'm not slandering Gyus at all because his math and charts are very accurate from a numbers standpoint, but from actual gameplay it tells a different story. At ~200 MS we will get a proc every 1.4 seconds, or 5 procs every 7 seconds. PD's proc lasts 8 seconds, so 8 / 1.4 = 5.714 procs on average and reflects the previous calculation of 5 procs per 7 seconds. That implies there is a semi-constant 6 proc stack and the occasional 5 stack. Furthermore, with cupid involved, there is potential for 7 stacks max for a short duration.

Note that a PD reaching 6 stacks without zerk would reach the 100 ms speed, yet there is never an increase even tho 6 stacks are clearly reached... Further showing the cap is 200 ms.

Video used as source: Tier 3 Boss - 1 Minute 55 Seconds:

Posted on 6/25/14 7:03:37 PM | Show thread starter's posts only

My head hurts :)

Posted on 6/25/14 7:15:49 PM | Show thread starter's posts only

Very interesting, and well done on the analysis, couple questions though, I'm assuming the PD in question is 9/9 is it also berserk 5/5? What makes you so certain he reaches the so called "Speed cap" at 30 seconds?

Posted on 6/25/14 7:21:00 PM | Show thread starter's posts only

ToolFanSixtyNin replied at 6-25-2014 07:15 PM
Very interesting, and well done on the analysis, couple questions though, I'm assuming the PD in que ...

Its 9/9 and I think revit (although at 9/9 berserk isn't needed) also I compared the speed at 30 seconds compared to before and after... It matched the after speed. I'll link the vid if you want to see for yourself.

Posted on 6/25/14 8:04:57 PM | Show thread starter's posts only

Yeah, please do, I'd like to check that out.

I guess the issue I have with this is that a statement such as:
"With PD 9/9 berserk is no longer needed on PD or Champ to achieve permastun."
Can be easily tested(well if you consider getting PD to 9/9 easy, lol)

Whereas a statement such as:
"With PD 9/9 there is no difference in max attack rate between berserk and revitalize"
Seems like more of an assumption as it would be more difficult to test and require direct comparison between a berserk 5/5 PD and a non zerk PD. And even then, you would need same skill level on Cupids(9/9 to guarantee there is no difference)

Posted on 6/25/14 8:27:13 PM | Show thread starter's posts only

I was reading then I realized you put takes 7 attacks to proc then you did 60 x 7 = 420 attacks

yes, it takes 7 attacks to proc as in 7 attacks to be able to proc on the next but technically it's (from my memory) 8 attacks, 8th attack being the proc.

so shouldn't it be 60 x 8 = 480 attacks

??? maybe my math is wrong. just got off work and head is a bit of a buzz

bada bing and bada boom
Posted on 6/25/14 8:41:40 PM | Show thread starter's posts only

Good observation.

Will try to count again with zerk PD later.

Posted on 6/25/14 9:17:46 PM | Show thread starter's posts only

Here is another video

from 2:00 down to 0:00,  PD proced 88 times in total, and there are several times that PD proced twice within 1 sec. So I think it's clear that the limit is 100ms.

Posted on 6/25/14 9:31:38 PM | Show thread starter's posts only

guoyuus replied at 6-25-2014 09:17 PM
Here is another video

Thanks for the link. I've counted 89 procs in the 2 minutes, but either way that's not conclusive of a 100 ms cap.

88 procs * 7 attacks per proc is 616 attacks. Keep in mind during those 120 seconds Cupid has the potential to proc 20 times, saving up to 60 attacks. So 120 seconds divided by 566 attacks = 215.8 attack rate.

Let's assume cupid had no affect on PD's procs. 120 / 616 = 194 MS attack rate, which is very close to 200 ms, and it ignores cupid's energy boost.

I'm sorry gyus but I think that video shows a cap of 200 again.

Posted on 6/25/14 9:34:21 PM | Show thread starter's posts only

in hero trial pd stacks can wipe out your base faster than minotaur... unless i'm missing something here?...